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  • Engine skipping/surging under load

    Hi All,

    Putting this in the "General" topic as I'm at a loss as to where my issue actually is. So the background is I have a 120 series, auto. I'm the second owner and it has been regularly serviced since new. The issue I have is the engine, typically when under load, will skip or surge as if it's misfiring. I'm not overly mechanically-minded so forgive me if I'm being a bit non-technical in my description

    What I have worked out so far is the following:
    - it is usually worse after rain - but not always.
    - it is worse when in reverse and when steering (i.e. reversing out of a driveway).
    - warm or cold engine makes no difference.
    - it appears randomly; one day it will be really bad, the very next it will behave perfectly.
    - it usually happens during idling or in reverse but has happened right up to 110km/hr (which is a real jolt).
    - it very rarely happens under moderate to heavy acceleration.
    - it does not happen in neutral.
    - I can replicate it pretty consistently if I drive at 60km/hr then without changing acceleration, start up a gradual hill. The point at which the car decides it's time to drop down a gear (out of over-drive?), it will skip up to half a dozen times in quick succession before dropping down a gear and be ok again.
    - when it first started happening, I tried disconnecting the battery which - perhaps coincidentally - make the problem go away for about a week before returning.

    Last service I had, I wasn't able to replicate the issue as it seems to randomly appear and disappear though of late it's become worse and more consistent so hopefully I'll be able to demonstrate the issue to my mechanic. All the mechanic was able to guess at last time was fuel filter but a new one made no difference to the problem. Before I take it in for its next service, I'm just wondering if the above list of symptoms resonates with anyone here?

    Appreciate anything I can take to my mechanic.

    Cheers,

    Gavin

  • #2
    Is the vehicle a petrol or diesel?

    Comment


    • #3
      Bad or dirty MAF sensor?

      Comment


      • #4
        +1 have a look at the Maf sensor
        2014 Silver V6 GXL, Pacemaker Ceramic Extractors, ARB Deluxe Bar, Toyota Towbar, Stedi Light Bar ST3302 24 Inch, Tinted Windows and DingoTrails Seat Covers

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        • #5
          Sorry, fairly critical detail there. It's a petrol.

          Comment


          • #6
            Ok, thanks all. I've Googled and Youtubed the MAF sensor so I know what it is now and where it is. I'll pull it out and give it a clean and report back.

            *EDIT*
            I've spoken to my mechanic and he's confirmed that the MAF sensor is cleaned every service and the air filter changed every second service. So that means the MAF sensor has been cleaned at least twice, the air filter changed once and there were no error codes in the computer either.

            Cheers,

            Gavin
            Last edited by HiRAEdd; 28-01-2016, 10:57 AM. Reason: Spoken to my mechanic

            Comment


            • #7
              I'd still probably pull and clean your MAF yourself. No offence to mechanics, I have a lot as friends, but I always find things are done better if I just do them myself

              I'm sure your mechanic would also have inspected your spark plugs but you probably want to pull them, check the gaps on them, check the condition of them against common spark plug issues:

              http://www.ngk.com.au/spark-plugs/te...-plug-analysis

              Also your fuel filter could be choked with crap, that's cheap and easy to replace if it hasn't been done recently.

              Given the conditions you're describing, I'm surprised you're not seeing any warning lights on your dash. Toyota might be able to read some errors still, might be worth spending a few bucks getting them to plug their tool into the ECU to make sure everything is ok. Start with the simple stuff above though, you never know your luck!

              Comment


              • #8
                Moved to correct forum.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Plugs & Ignition coil/coils.

                  v6 gloom n doom.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by pilgrim_traveller View Post
                    I'd still probably pull and clean your MAF yourself. No offence to mechanics, I have a lot as friends, but I always find things are done better if I just do them myself

                    I'm sure your mechanic would also have inspected your spark plugs but you probably want to pull them, check the gaps on them, check the condition of them against common spark plug issues:

                    http://www.ngk.com.au/spark-plugs/te...-plug-analysis

                    Also your fuel filter could be choked with crap, that's cheap and easy to replace if it hasn't been done recently.

                    Given the conditions you're describing, I'm surprised you're not seeing any warning lights on your dash. Toyota might be able to read some errors still, might be worth spending a few bucks getting them to plug their tool into the ECU to make sure everything is ok. Start with the simple stuff above though, you never know your luck!
                    Yeah, I've just pulled out the MAF. I don't have any cleaner yet but on looks alone, it's silver, shiny and not a spec of anything in there.

                    Spark plugs or leads was one (uneducated) guess I had. I had a similar issue years ago in a different car which turned out to be degraded spark plug leads but I'm not sure if the new leads these days suffer the same type of internal break down?

                    Fuel filter was replaced last service so all good there (made no difference).

                    If my mechanic can't work it out next service, I think I'll have to take it to Toyota.

                    I've got some video of the problem happening now. Let me see if I can upload that somewhere and share it...

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Ok, got some videos now. You'll need the volume up a bit to really hear the skipping.

                      The first one shows the engine itself, idling in reverse. You can visibly see the engine shake each time it skips.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        The second one shows the dash during start up > park > reverse > neutral > reverse. You can see the tacho dropping each time the skip occurs.

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                        • #13
                          I doubt it'll be MAF related. I'd be scoping each coil pack to get a reading and cross reference with specs. Seems more ignition electrical, like a coil or plug breaking down on a cylinder. Swap coils/plugs to different cylinders and see if you can shift the problem to another cylinder.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by sunny120 View Post
                            I doubt it'll be MAF related. I'd be scoping each coil pack to get a reading and cross reference with specs. Seems more ignition electrical, like a coil or plug breaking down on a cylinder. Swap coils/plugs to different cylinders and see if you can shift the problem to another cylinder.
                            Starting to get out of the realms of me knowing what to do there I'm guessing you need a multi-meter to measure that kind of thing?? But definitely something I'll ask my mechanic to do a full check on.

                            Frustratingly, we had two big storms and tonnes of rain yesterday and normally that would mean the skipping would be way worse today. Instead, she's running like a dream this morning. Argh!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              So got some good news today. Took the Prado in for it's service and naturally, the engine issue didn't happen all the way there and not at all during the test drive with the mechanic. So whilst I looked like a lying fool the mechanic had a couple of theories and I left the car with them.

                              Luckily, after I left, they were able to get the issue to happen and they quickly tracked the issue down to a cracked spark plug. The working theory is they cracked it when they replaced them 20,000k ago (or it cracked very soon after) and it's been causing intermittent issues ever since.

                              Lucky for me, the work is still under warranty so the replacement spark plug and labour cost me nothing and my Prado is now purring as smooth as the day I got her

                              Thanks for all your help and suggestions. Even though the issue turned out to be something else, I learnt a number of things about the Prado from the info in this post.

                              Cheers,

                              Gavin

                              Comment

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