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  • I'm looking forward to seeing how the setup goes over xmas, with a week away and as little time behind the wheel as possible it will be interesting to see.

    Out of interest Tim, if I need to remove the AUX battery, must I disconnect the +ve cable from both the SC80's circuit breaker and AUX battery terminal or can I simply remove the earth to shut it down?

    We have to get round to replacing the tinnie's battery but I have in the past used the AUX to get us out of trouble. Disconnecting the earth and removing the battery terminals is easier...
    Cheers
    Micheal.

    2008 GXL D4D Auto. GOING... GOING... GONE
    2015 GXL 1GD Auto. And it begins again...

    Comment


    • Hi Michael, if it it easier to disconnect the Isolators EARTH wire, then that is the way to go and you will not harm anything by doing so.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by drivesafe View Post

        Even though you are doing lots of short trips, the SC80 is still charging and more importantly, conditioning your cranking battery.

        By the time you go on that trip, because your cranking battery is not only kept in a higher state of charge, because the way the SC80 allows the auxiliary battery to continually condition the cranking battery. Over a period of time, this continual conditioning of the cranking battery increases the cranking battery’s capacity and in most case, increases it back up to the battery’s original capacity when new.

        So when you go on that trip, you will now have around twice the usable capacity you had with your DC/DC setup.
        .
        Got a few questions if you could please explain.

        How does this device condition your start battery on short trips.
        How does it get any battery to a higher state of charge as the charge rate is limited to 13.6v .
        What is the amp output/load rating of your solenoid/relay.

        Thanks Dan
        Arb colour code deluxe bar, safari snorkel, lightforce venom HID's, GME uhf remote face, redarc tow pro, redarc bcdc 1240, pioneer platform, 40" curved light bar, dual battery, 3" SS exhaust, EGR mod, trans cooler upgrade, provent catch can, scangauge 2, diesel care secondary fuel filter, Tin's bash plates and actuator gaurd, 2in Bilstien and kings lift,

        Comment


        • Hi Dan, because of the way my isolators work, the auxiliary battery will be connected to the cranking battery when you start your motor.

          Most of the energy required to start your motor will come from the cranking battery, but some will come from the auxiliary battery.

          So right from the start ( pardon the pun ) your cranking battery will not be as low as it would be in normal operation, and this means the used cranking battery energy will be replaced in a shorter drive time.

          Then, even with a short drives, the auxiliary battery will also have it’s used energy replaced but will also end up in a higher state of charge than your cranking battery, when you turn the motor off.

          Again, because of the way my isolators work, keeping the two batteries connected, the auxiliary battery, being in a higher state of charge, will now VERY SLOWLY back discharge into the cranking battery.

          This back discharging, over a period of time, progressively raise the settled state of charge of the cranking battery and, over an even longer period of time, will recondition the cranking battery, returning some if not all of it’s lost capacity.

          My isolators have been operating in this manor for more than 25 years.

          The SC80 and DT90 ( just about to be released in a new version ) have a continuos current rating of 90 amps, but will tolerate surges of up to 200 amps for a few seconds.

          Dan, there is a lot more to how my isolators work, but this should help to answer your questions.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by drivesafe View Post
            Hi Dan, because of the way my isolators work, the auxiliary battery will be connected to the cranking battery when you start your motor.

            Most of the energy required to start your motor will come from the cranking battery, but some will come from the auxiliary battery.

            So right from the start ( pardon the pun ) your cranking battery will not be as low as it would be in normal operation, and this means the used cranking battery energy will be replaced in a shorter drive time.

            Then, even with a short drives, the auxiliary battery will also have it’s used energy replaced but will also end up in a higher state of charge than your cranking battery, when you turn the motor off.

            Again, because of the way my isolators work, keeping the two batteries connected, the auxiliary battery, being in a higher state of charge, will now VERY SLOWLY back discharge into the cranking battery.

            This back discharging, over a period of time, progressively raise the settled state of charge of the cranking battery and, over an even longer period of time, will recondition the cranking battery, returning some if not all of it’s lost capacity.

            My isolators have been operating in this manor for more than 25 years.

            The SC80 and DT90 ( just about to be released in a new version ) have a continuos current rating of 90 amps, but will tolerate surges of up to 200 amps for a few seconds.

            Dan, there is a lot more to how my isolators work, but this should help to answer your questions.
            Sounds interesting, so does this mean that if (like myself and many others) you have a fridge permanently in the back running the aux down the conditioning won't work.
            Also if the alt only chargers to 13.6 to both batteries how when it back charges is this going to increase the voltage correct me if im wrong but doesn't a std lead acid need to be charged to 14.2 "fully charged ".
            Arb colour code deluxe bar, safari snorkel, lightforce venom HID's, GME uhf remote face, redarc tow pro, redarc bcdc 1240, pioneer platform, 40" curved light bar, dual battery, 3" SS exhaust, EGR mod, trans cooler upgrade, provent catch can, scangauge 2, diesel care secondary fuel filter, Tin's bash plates and actuator gaurd, 2in Bilstien and kings lift,

            Comment


            • Hi again Dan, if you are running a fridge permanently, it will not run for long if you are doing short trips all the time.

              But even with short trips, as Michael has posted, with my setup, your auxiliary battery is going to charge a lot faster. So this means that while you will not fully recharge your auxiliary battery on short trips, you will replace much, MUCH more of the used capacity.

              And remember, you are charging two batteries at the same time, so your are replacing a far greater amount of used capacity and in a shorter drive time.

              All lead acid batteries can be FULLY CHARGED with a lot less than 14.2v

              For instance, somewhere on the Fullriver web site, they have a graph that shows you can fully charge some of their batteries with as little as 13.0v, but it will take a long time.

              Optima, on their web site, state that their batteries can be fully charged with 13.65v.

              I have not come across a single lead acid battery that has a minimum recharge voltage requirement greater than 13.7v, let alone 14.2v.

              But we are talking about short drive situations and in these types of use, you are never going to fully charge any battery, but no other setup allows for so much used battery capacity to be replaced in the same time that my systems do.
              drivesafe
              Senior Member
              Last edited by drivesafe; 09-12-2016, 10:25 PM. Reason: typo

              Comment


              • Well I just wanted some direction for a dual battery system to suit Our new Prado after 23 pages I am really more confused than before.

                So What is my best bet ?
                Just want a set up to run 1x 40lt engel fridge for 2 days
                Previously on my 79 series I ran this matson VRS insolator http://www.supercheapauto.com.au/Pro...nuFrom=1021643
                Worked a treat never had any issues always worked, both start and AUX batteries were supercharge brand 5y/o and still going fine

                Will the same matson kit work ?

                Comment


                • Originally posted by drivesafe
                  Quite the contrary.

                  Based on REAL WORLD use, as supplied to me in feedback from owners of new 150s, dBC, if you had bought one of my isolators, instead of being sucked in by the grossly exaggerated advertising hype they use to sell DC/DC devices.

                  Not only would you have saved a bucket load of money.

                  I have no intentions of proving anything to you. I’ll let my customers do that.
                  Have you done any real world testing on what effect it does to your ALT. Because your making the alt work harder what temps is it going to?
                  Whats the longevity of it now? ( there has been people on here that failed early maybe because of this)
                  You may have saved some money initially but if the extra load has created premature wear a new alt is not cheap


                  I too am a unlucky one that only gets 13.6v on a good day most times sitting on 13.5
                  Arb colour code deluxe bar, safari snorkel, lightforce venom HID's, GME uhf remote face, redarc tow pro, redarc bcdc 1240, pioneer platform, 40" curved light bar, dual battery, 3" SS exhaust, EGR mod, trans cooler upgrade, provent catch can, scangauge 2, diesel care secondary fuel filter, Tin's bash plates and actuator gaurd, 2in Bilstien and kings lift,

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by Hally View Post
                    Have you done any real world testing on what effect it does to your ALT. Because your making the alt work harder what temps is it going to?
                    Whats the longevity of it now? ( there has been people on here that failed early maybe because of this)
                    You may have saved some money initially but if the extra load has created premature wear a new alt is not cheap
                    Hi Hally, you can not over load or over work an alternator.


                    Originally posted by Hally View Post
                    ( there has been people on here that failed early maybe because of this)
                    Sorry Hally but no such thing occurs. For an alternator to fail, prematurely or otherwise, there will always be additional factors involved, like the alternator was faulty in the first place, being full of mud and grit, or someone has used the wrong solvent when cleaning the motor and so on.

                    In all cases, if you apply a higher current load than an alternator can produce, the alternator’s VOLTAGE drops accordingly.

                    In a DC circuit, when you lower the voltage, you will also lower the current demand for any devices connected to that circuit.

                    This is basic Laws of Physics 101.

                    There are a couple of exceptions to this, and DC/DC devices are one. When the voltage drops on the input side, to be able to maintain the same output current and voltage, the input current demand of a DC/DC device increase.

                    Again, you can not ware out an alternator just by applying high current demands. They are self protecting, and this is one of the primary reasons they changed from generators to alternators 70 odd years ago.

                    As far as alternators failing, I use to own an auto electrical business and I have seen plenty of alternators fail on vehicles that do not have so much as driving lights added to them.

                    Having any form of dual battery system fitted to a vehicle makes no difference to the alternator’s longevity.

                    Comment


                    • First and final warnings!

                      Another dual battery thread is about to be removed if you guys keep going.

                      Off topic and non required posts removed, and infractions given.
                      Piggy
                      Water pistol pilot.
                      Last edited by Piggy; 12-12-2016, 11:38 AM.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by dBC
                        I wonder if it's a build date thing, maybe they changed the ECU firmware at some stage. I think mine was built in March 2016.
                        I have a Sept 2015 2.8D and it outputs 13.4-13.6. Max I have seen is 13.8, but normally around 13.6. I think it would definitely be helpful if people posted their voltages - as you say if there is a pattern where later vehicles are getting higher voltages, then it would maybe suggest there is a software patch, and we could lobby Toyota Australia to release it/authorize the service people to allow the voltage setting to be raised.

                        If higher concern to me is the resting voltage I am seeing on my cranking battery - before starting I am seeing around 12.4V, and sometime as low as 12V. This seems low to me for what be a fully charged battery. For example we drove 1 1/2 hours to a campsite this weekend, car sat there for 2 days then when i went to start it the battery read 12V. So if people could post their battery resting voltage before start also, that would be helpful.

                        I have started this as a new thread to avoid side tracking this one and to consolidate the information so it is easier to scan, but also because I am concerned this thread may self destruct.....

                        http://www.pradopoint.com/showthread...e-for-new-2-8D

                        Comment


                        • Hi all.

                          We have just bought a brand new 150 Prado and need to put a dual battery in it for the fridge.

                          How has Toyota wired up the vehicle?

                          Is it that the two batteries are directly connected to form one large crank battery?

                          or

                          Do I need to put an isolator in for the second battery?

                          or

                          Do I need to put in a DC Charger (I have a Redarc BCDC 1240)?

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by drivesafe View Post
                            Hi Dan, because of the way my isolators work, the auxiliary battery will be connected to the cranking battery when you start your motor.

                            Most of the energy required to start your motor will come from the cranking battery, but some will come from the auxiliary battery.

                            So right from the start ( pardon the pun ) your cranking battery will not be as low as it would be in normal operation, and this means the used cranking battery energy will be replaced in a shorter drive time.

                            Then, even with a short drives, the auxiliary battery will also have it’s used energy replaced but will also end up in a higher state of charge than your cranking battery, when you turn the motor off.

                            Again, because of the way my isolators work, keeping the two batteries connected, the auxiliary battery, being in a higher state of charge, will now VERY SLOWLY back discharge into the cranking battery.

                            This back discharging, over a period of time, progressively raise the settled state of charge of the cranking battery and, over an even longer period of time, will recondition the cranking battery, returning some if not all of it’s lost capacity.

                            My isolators have been operating in this manor for more than 25 years.

                            The SC80 and DT90 ( just about to be released in a new version ) have a continuos current rating of 90 amps, but will tolerate surges of up to 200 amps for a few seconds.

                            Dan, there is a lot more to how my isolators work, but this should help to answer your questions.
                            Just wondering Tim, on Storage Mode, does the SC80 consider any voltages above 12.80 to be surplus and allow it to back discharge into the cranking battery?
                            I'm noticing that each time I switch it over to storage mode I always have 12.80 - 12.81 at the Optima even when starting out with 12.95.
                            Cheers
                            Micheal.

                            2008 GXL D4D Auto. GOING... GOING... GONE
                            2015 GXL 1GD Auto. And it begins again...

                            Comment


                            • Second Battery Mounting

                              There's a lot of good electrical info in this thread but very little on mounting a second battery. I couldn't find anything specific on this subject.

                              I haven't put a second battery in yet & I know there's a place next to the radiator where one will fit. It looks as if it just needs a tray to sit the battery in & a clamp to hold it down.
                              Is this all that's needed?

                              The aftermarket suppliers suggest that a metal tray with a supporting bracket is needed as the weight of the battery without extra support will eventually cause the inner guard to crack.
                              Anyone know if this is just marketing hype or is it correct?

                              I know my battery weighs 25 kg so there is a lot of weight there but it does appear this spot has been made to take another battery.

                              Can someone give me some info on what would be the best way to mount a second battery?

                              Thanks
                              [COLOR=#b22222]Prado 150 2.8 GX Auto - ARB Bull Bar, Towbar, Dual Batteries, UHF, 2" lift with King Springs & Bilsteins[/COLOR]

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by geo View Post
                                There's a lot of good electrical info in this thread but very little on mounting a second battery. I couldn't find anything specific on this subject.

                                I haven't put a second battery in yet & I know there's a place next to the radiator where one will fit. It looks as if it just needs a tray to sit the battery in & a clamp to hold it down.
                                Is this all that's needed?

                                The aftermarket suppliers suggest that a metal tray with a supporting bracket is needed as the weight of the battery without extra support will eventually cause the inner guard to crack.
                                Anyone know if this is just marketing hype or is it correct?

                                I know my battery weighs 25 kg so there is a lot of weight there but it does appear this spot has been made to take another battery.

                                Can someone give me some info on what would be the best way to mount a second battery?

                                Thanks
                                if your going down the Redarc DC DC path ARB make a tray that the charger can be mounted on.

                                Comment

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