Should I refund?

[Pugaree Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pugaree]

A bit of help please.

I have just sold an old car, a 45 year old Daimler. I haven't misrepresented it and I believe I have been honest in every way, IThere was no hard sell, you either like it or you don't. I was also more than negotiable on price, I dropped from 6500 to 5000 because he showed promise that he would continue to look after it. He even spent two days researching and getting prices for the bodywork he wanted to fix up.

Anyway we've had a beer, transferred some money and he's told be how excited he was and all the plans he had. He's got the car home and two hours later he has rung me full of remorse and wanting a refund.

He is a young fella, may 23/24 and has had cars that he has done up for a profit before. He can't tell me why the cold feet all of a sudden. I told him he had buyers remorse, most people go through it, when they buy with emotion and try to justify with logic and told him to sleep on it. He has followed up with a text saying he will bring back the car in the morning and I can keep 300 for the mucking around.

My initial thought is, bad luck, you have done the research and I have been completely honest with the car and dropped my price because I was comfortable that it was going to a good home.

My dilemma is, should I take the car back? Or make him live with the decision?

[Pugaree Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pugaree]

Had few drinks, sorry if above doesn't read as well as it could.

[glen_ep Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close glen_ep]

A logical approach...

If you believe you can sell again for the same or higher price, than that $300 is easy profit.

If it'll be difficult to resell well it's completely fair to refuse - buyer beware and so forth - but one little catch comes to mind: Buyers can 'neglect' to transfer the registration to their name, and run up speeding fines, parking fines and toll penalties in your name. That's a hassle you don't want.

[Pugaree Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pugaree]

A logical approach...

If you believe you can sell again for the same or higher price, than that $300 is easy profit.

If it'll be difficult to resell well it's completely fair to refuse - buyer beware and so forth - but one little catch comes to mind: Buyers can 'neglect' to transfer the registration to their name, and run up speeding fines, parking fines and toll penalties in your name. That's a hassle you don't want.

Thanks, appreciate the reply. I have had a fair hassle selling it, too many tyre kickers wearing me down, being in Canberra we have a small, limited market and interstate buyers are hard to get. Only reason for selling is I have taken on a small business and desperately need the space in the garage, other wise it's a good car and would have been happy to hang on to it. In fact I was quite sad to see it go.

As for the fines etc, it would be a hassle but I can show what time he took possession of the car etc.

[Guest Close Guest]

The buyer can keep the car.

In SA the seller fills up the disposal notice on the back of the rego papers. Isn't this nationwide?

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

Good points made by Glen. You don't need the hassle.
You could be nice & refund him, but why? Sounds like he had plenty of time to think it over.
When you say transferred some money, is that fully paid for?
I think it would be silly to refund him, he can sell it if he has changed his mind. Too late! Crazy ask of him really.
The other thing to think about did he steal or swap out a part on it? Mmmmmm............?
I'd say I will put the price on the mucking around & I'm not you but that sounds like $1500, you know only as a good will gesture.
But I always come back to, it's not worth further risks & hassle.
How does it go? So so sorry mate, wife already has plans for the funds & it's locked in Eddie.

A disheartening decision but I think the deal is done.

[glen_ep Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close glen_ep]

The buyer can keep the car.

In SA the seller fills up the disposal notice on the back of the rego papers. Isn't this nationwide?

In NSW we also have notice on the back of the rego which is filled and signed, but handing in that from is only half of the process. The buyer must complete the transfer process and pay their fees, otherwise the car is stuck in limbo, and penalties revert to the last registered owner.

It's even worse when selling to other states, or if a small spelling mistake was made on the form, as the registration authorities cannot access other states databases to confirm what the buyers name/ID (and responsibility falls back on the seller to provide correct details). It can eventually get to a point of desperation. The seller can't cancel the registration - it won't be allowed it as they've already handed in the disposal (and have no plates to hand in). They can't claim theft because that would be a false statement and punishable.

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

In Mexico you fill out a transfer form. It has vehicle & both party's details.
That is your proof if the buyer does not follow through hand in form & pay fees.
You can then hand in your copy & they will transfer & send new owner a notice asking for roadworthy certificate & fees & it's no longer your problem.
years ago you could cancell the rego, I have done this after receiving rego renewal a year later. They don't like it when they get done unregistered.
Dodging transfer fees & fines & tolls, now when I sell I check 14 days later & most people have done the law abiding thing.

[Guest Close Guest]

On the last vehicle I sold the buyer contacted me a few months later asking to change the date of sale. Either they haven't completed their transfer or they got fined. Either way the disposal notice has the buyer's details and I had already submitted my disposal notice. Never heard from them since.

[Pugaree Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pugaree]

OK, I got an text this early this morning asking when he could come over and talk about the situation. I spoke to him around 8:30 and said that as far as I'm concerned, he has bought the car and I won't be taking it back. He seemed to take that news OK.

I called the bank to see if the funds were there pending release, they couldn't see anything. I rang him and asked whether he had cancelled the transaction, he assured me he hadn't. He then said he was putting it on Gumtree and I offered to send him details of two people who had showed interest last night. At this point I have also realised that the rego papers with his signature etc for disposal was with him so I called him again and asked for the paper work back.

An hour later I hear a car in the drive, he's bought the car back and his Mum is with him in another car. They both ask me to take the car back and keep $500 for my troubles. I asked him to take away the car and that I would talk to the Missus when she got home, I didn't appreciate being ambushed like that.

I head inside expecting him to take the car and await my call. Anyhow, I hear his Mums car leave, but no Jag, they have both left in her car and the keys were left on the front doormat. I tried to call him, he wouldn't accept my call. I got a text message a few minutes later that said

"Sorry Mike, I have no documents stating it's mine. I haven't signed anything nor have I got a receipt. The car is in your name and its yours and you have it"

I go out to the car to retrieve the paperwork that he signed last night and he has torn off the section with his signatures and taken it with him.

I've been down to the Police station, and while it's not a criminal matter they have created a job bad will give him a call. That's where we are now, more to come I would say.

[foxclan Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close foxclan]

Sheet of a position to be in when a good faith deal was done. Obviously his Mumma did not want another one of his "dream cars" in her driveway and wouldn't
release the funds tied up in the corner of his Hanky!
Good Luck Pugaree.
Regards
Troy

[Guest Close Guest]

That's poor form. What's happened to the money transfer then? Don't believe they can just reverse it like that.

[Pugaree Member Find all posts View Profile Close Pugaree]

I'm still waiting for the transfer, it might take three days. He guarantees he hasn't cancelled it.

And yes, its all down to mummy not liking it.

I have just sent him a text with the way I see things panning out.

1. The money clears and he collects the car.

2. The money clears and he doesn't collect it. I can report it abandoned and provide his details as a point of contact.

3. He cancels the payment and we'll see each other in court.

[glen_ep Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close glen_ep]

Be careful here... You have a partially complete transfer form but no money. Money is power and judging by their actions to leave the car at your house, it indicates they are certain no money has been transferred. Perhaps the guy didn't even have the money, and was going to have his mother transfer it later that night.

Now the scary part, what if he claims that he's already paid you in cash, and you haven't gave him the car? Do you have any evidence which can be used to protect yourself from that? I'd be thinking about getting them to sign a letter which states they are not purchasing it and have not paid anything. Legal advice might also be an idea.

[kenny5000 Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close kenny5000]

After reading this, out of curiosity I had a look about cancelling transfrers. All the banks websites i looked at say that they cant be reversed as the person making the transfer has already given permission to transfer the funds!

Hope it works out !!