Bilstein/Kings combo Information

[Madkore Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Madkore]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

I have both sets of Kings Springs KTFS101, KTRS102 (Std height) and KTFR101, KTRR102 (Raised). I currently have the Std Height and Bilsteins BE5-A712 AND BE5-A712 fitted to my 08 Prado and next week will fit the Raised springs for an outback trip.
Garry

I appear to have the same shocks, the F4-BE5-A712-Typ 2/- and the A713.

I was under the impression that different shocks are needed to run raised springs, but from this comment, 05oiler switches between the standard and raised springs while running the same shocks.

Can anyone elaborate?

Is it possible to run my set up with the same shocks but raised springs, and it is still safe?

[9W6VX Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 9W6VX]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Guys,

For those who are using King coil springs upfront on your Prado 120, do they sag after time?

I have a Hilux dual cab ute with Bilsteins (BE-D563) and King KTFR-101 with ARB steel bar. No winch or dual battery.

After close to 2 years, I find the front has sagged about 8mm. :roll: :roll:

I am contemplating changing the coils either to King KTFR-101HD or others.

After all the Prado 120 diesel has the same engine and front suspension as the Hilux.

Care to share your experience.

Thanks

[9W6VX Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 9W6VX]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

switched,

I have been trying to get the specifications of the King coils and even contacted King directly.

They did not come to the party and did not want to give the specifications of the spring rate.

Where did you get the information?

I have been told that the wire diameter for KTFR-101 is 17mm whereas EFS uses 18mm on their Hllux/Prado part numbers.

[switched Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close switched]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

switched,

I have been trying to get the specifications of the King coils and even contacted King directly.

They did not come to the party and did not want to give the specifications of the spring rate.

Where did you get the information?

I have been told that the wire diameter for KTFR-101 and KTFR-101HD are 17mm whereas EFS uses 18mm on their Hllux/Prado part numbers.

Hi Brendon,
I spoke with the local distributor in SA for the basics, recommendations etc. I also spoke with a chap at Kings at their QLD office. The spring rates were from an email I made to Kings shortly after this from their sales and tech services (Jeremy Holmes was his name)

Cheers, Jase

[9W6VX Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 9W6VX]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Jase,

Thanks for info.

This is the info from our newhilux.net forum and if I add your figures, the King specs would be as follows:

KING
KTFR 101 - free length 375mm, 17mm wire diameter, spring rate 660 lbs
KTFR 101HD - 375mm, 18mm wire, 800 lbs
KTFR 101HHD - 390mm, 18mm wire, spring rate unknown.

As a comparison, here are the other coils for Hilux/Prado 120:

OME
OME 883 - 375mm, 17mm wire, spring rate unknown
OME 884 - 390mm, 17mm wire, spring rate unknown
OME885 - 395mm, 17mm wire, spring rate unknown

EFS
TPR 104E - free length unknown, 18mm wire, spring rate 650 lbs (up to 35kgs load bearing accessories for Prado 120, 60kg for Hilux)
TPR 104HDE - free length unknown, 18mm wire, 800 lbs (35-55kgs load bearing accessories for Prado 120, 95-120kgs for Hilux)


Hope you all find this information sharing useful.

[switched Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close switched]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

As a comparison, here are the other coils for Hilux/Prado 120:

OME
OME 883 - 375mm, 17mm wire, spring rate unknown 590lb/ib
OME 884 - 390mm, 17mm wire, spring rate unknown 590lb/ib
OME885 - 395mm, 17mm wire, spring rate unknown 590lb/ib

Brendon, ive updated the OME spring rates for you. This is listed in the OME component thread.
Jase

[9W6VX Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 9W6VX]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Jase,

Thanks mate for the additional info.

No wonder we get lots of guys complaining about sag with OME coils upfront.

Will be posting this info back to newhilux.net forum.

Have yet to hear of any one complaining that their King coils have sagged after time.

Well, probably mine was made on a Friday. :P :P :P

[Lakey Lurker Find all posts View Profile Close Lakey]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

I have just collected the Prado after having the Bilstien and King Combo fitted. Part numbers for springs KTFR101 front and KTFR 102 rear. The shocks are the A712/A713 combo F+R. Also had polyairs installed as we tow on most trips.

Ended up with the following measurements

Front Before: 740mm
Front after: 818mm (Circlip in highest position) Inc sov bar and dual batteries

Rear before: 775m
Rear after: 840mm

The front came up higher than expected. I will give it a 1000km's of testing and if it doesnt settle I may drop down one circlip or throw a winch in to bring it down. Ride quality is firmer and tighter, especially cornering it and feels great. Will see how it goes on the trip in 2 weeks and will try and post some pics!

[Madkore Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Madkore]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

I have both sets of Kings Springs KTFS101, KTRS102 (Std height) and KTFR101, KTRR102 (Raised). I currently have the Std Height and Bilsteins BE5-A712 AND BE5-A712 fitted to my 08 Prado and next week will fit the Raised springs for an outback trip.
Garry

Sorry to re-hash this comment but I was just wondering if anyone could help.

I was under the impression that different shocks are needed to run raised springs, but from this comment, 05oiler switches between the standard and raised springs while running the same shocks.

Can anyone elaborate?

Is it possible to run my set up with the same shocks but raised springs, and it is still safe?

[switched Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close switched]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Well finally the shocks arrived this week, and today I spent the day putting in the new king/bilstein combo. I ended installing them without a second set of hands - took me 5 working hours, but ended up waiting around at home for 3.5hrs as the front struts were sitting at Pedders waiting for them to remove the top cap and swap over the front springs to the new strut. They actually stuffed up the position of the bottom eye (of the strut) in relation to the top cap even though I specifically told them the orientation and even offered to give them the Toyota workshop diagram indicating the orientation to which he replied “We’ve done this more then once”. So second attempt and another half hour waiting they were ready. Their spring compressor ‘press’ managed to scratch the crap out of the bottom of the strut with the chain that holds the strut in their press.Grrr. At least the paint damage is not seen with the wheel in place. Also better mention that I have put the circlip in the middle groove on the front strut.

I didn’t manage to take many pictures during this install since I was doing this job by myself.

For the rear:
Note that I didn’t disconnect the rear panhard rod, or disconnect the rear sway bar link. I used the prado jack positioned on the rear bump stop to give me enough leverage to drop the old spring out and put the new one in. Very easy.

For the front:
I didn’t need to disconnect the steering linkage. I did remove the front bash plate and the front sway bar (which has the link rods attached). This gave me enough room with the steering full locked to remove the strut from the front. I did use the prado jack on the top wishbone and bottom wishbone to make it a little easier (mainly to locate the bolt through the strut eye) but no probs whatsoever. I actually expected the front install to be a little more difficult. I also attacked all threads two days prior with WD40 to make life easier and I reckon that saved me a lot of hassle in the long run with remove the nuts (especially the 3 top nuts on the front suspension - note ratchet spanners would make this very easy).

The car is booked in tomorrow for a wheel alignment

So how does it all stack up??
Here are the figures.
Before Lift (with 85 L of fuel)
FD: 740mm
FP: 738mm
RD: 775mm
RP: 775mm

After Lift:
FD: 810mm (= +70mm)
FP: 807mm (= +69mm)
RD: 825mm (= +50mm)
RP: 827mm (= +52mm)

EDIT:
After a couple of days now, the suspension has settled somewhat. Checking now, I have:
After Lift:
FD: 793 mm (= +53mm)
FP: 800 mm (= +62mm)
RD: 832 mm (= +57mm)
RP: 830 mm (= +55mm)

So here are the pics:



NEW GEAR:





BEFORE INSTALL:









REAR INSTALL:








FRONT INSTALL:


(Sorry about the orientation)




AFTER INSTALL:

[9W6VX Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 9W6VX]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Jase,

Cool mate! Very nice......

Did you use KTFR-101 or the 101HD?

What is the Billie part number at the front end?

[switched Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close switched]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Jase,

Cool mate! Very nice......

Did you use KTFR-101 or the 101HD?

What is the Billie part number at the front end?

I went the Non HD in the end.. I have a dual batt setup but in rear and no real plans for a winch at this stage. I spoke with two chaps who went with the HD kings in the front and removed them due to harshness (I cant quite recall their setups either).

Check this pic out for the part numbers:

Cheers, Jase

[9W6VX Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close 9W6VX]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Thanks for the info mate.

I must have been on my blinkers..... did not see the picture in the post........ ops: ops: ops:

I am confused as to why the Prado 120 series front struts are different from the Hilux when I understand the front end are basically the same. The coils are the same too.

Hilux uses BE5-D563 at the front.

[Madkore Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close Madkore]

Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Looks awesome Jase and great pictorial. You have definitely inspired me to chuck some raised springs in (after a few modifications to the garage - nothing an angle grinder and welder won't fix).

The only thing you neglected to mention is whether you are happy with the finished product?

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Re: Bilstein/Kings combo Information

Thanks Jarrod, this is one of those satisying mods.. Really happy with the setup, but only have a few kms on them. Had the alignment done by a fellow who does the alignments for the main ARB dealer in Adelaide (he also does suspension upgrades himself for ARB when they have a lot on). Hopefully give them a good work out over the weekend