diesel rattle in D4D Prado

[Drosey Junior Member Find all posts View Profile Close Drosey]

make sure they're done at each service (minimum) - they don't take long to run out 2.9 or 3.0mm3...[/QUOTE]

I havent got my readings in front of me at the moment but one was 5.0 and another 3.2 when Toyota changed all four yesterday.
Its only done 4000k since the last service and all were in spec then, so yes it doesn't take long for major changes in them.

Regards
Dave

[DGW Senior Member Find all posts View Profile Close DGW]

How long after starting the engine is the cold injector reading taken? Different forums seem say ASAP, wait one minute, wait 2 minutes before taking the cold injector reading.

Have seen big difference in the reading between ASAP and waiting one minute.

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

How long after starting the engine is the cold injector reading taken? Different forums seem say ASAP, wait one minute, wait 2 minutes before taking the cold injector reading.

Have seen big difference in the reading between ASAP and waiting one minute.

I believe Baileys diagnostic is to take cold readings after 60 secs, and then again when hot, after 40 secs. (it was posted somewhere on here). I've not noticed much difference in my readings between immediate and 60 secs after start following an overnight stop. They start to come down after about 2minutes.

[Mattfunk 120 Advanced Member Find all posts View Profile Close Mattfunk 120]

When's a mate did mine , he did, cold ignition only on, 30sec, 1 min, 2min, 3min,4min,5min & hot. Mainly so he could see a pattern instead of I or 2 readings only.

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

Yes they can go out fast once they are out of a good range.
Good is under 1, there are plenty with readings around 80-100,000k all under 1 even when cold, so if they can stay perfect so long, so now you know how fast they can go from high1's & 2's, to 3+ why risk it? Keep them fresh!

Remember to watch the total volume as well. Under 8-9 hot is fairly good. Under 18 when first started cold, (lower better) under 15 pretty quick, (60 secs) under 12 (spec) in 3-4 minutes, ideal 6 once warm & idling all accessories off.

There are other parameters to watch, it's not about exactly when to take readings, unless that's all you can do eg; diagnostics from remote place.
The best diagnostic is to watch it from cold to hot, an expert will know exactly where they are at.

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

Yet another set of Baileys that has an issue with the injector in pot 3!
Baileys know there is a problem, they're keeping a tally...

Perhaps Admins we should have a sticky on this titled 'Baileys Injectors issues' or 'Baileys Injector issue with Cylinder 3 after less than 12 months'.

Those with Baileys remanufactured injectors in their rigs, keep onto your injector feedback readings, make sure they're done at each service (minimum) - they don't take long to run out 2.9 or 3.0mm3...

How many sets of BDG injectors are there with issues?

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

Remember to watch the total volume as well. Under 8-9 hot is fairly good. Under 18 when first started cold, (lower better) under 15 pretty quick, (60 secs) under 12 (spec) in 3-4 minutes, ideal 6 once warm & idling all accessories off.

There are other parameters to watch, it's not about exactly when to take readings, unless that's all you can do eg; diagnostics from remote place.
The best diagnostic is to watch it from cold to hot, an expert will know exactly where they are at.

That's what puzzled me about mine. Total vol is about 12 from cold and 6 when hot. All under 1 when hot too. We will see what they say when they've had a look.

[MRW82 Member Find all posts View Profile Close MRW82]

How many sets of BDG injectors are there with issues?

Well you can add me to that list. Had baileys installed at rebuild time (about 3 weeks before they released their full DLC sets, just missed out). Have done 30,000 km in that time, approx 14 months. Haven't been fully happy with the Prado since the engine rebuild but haven't been able to figure out what's not right.
Regular feedback checks showed injectors all good. Winter comes and the cold starts get progressively noisier, feedback check suddenly shows injectors 1,2 and 3 all around -1 but injector 4 reading +2.6! Technically still in tolerance but obvious sign of an underlying issue. So after discussing the findings with Matt bailey I pulled the injectors and sent them down for evaluation for a warranty claim. 2 injectors were found to be faulty (even though only one had bad feedback readings). All 4 replaced under warranty with a set of full DLCs. My personal opinion is that there's been something not right with the injectors since the day they were installed, but that's only my opinion and I have no proof other than a gut feeling, maybe it was just the bitter taste of engine failure that I couldn't get rid of which made me nervous and suspicious of every little thing.
Matts theory for the failures was fuel quality (not contamination, just poor fuel grade). He recommended using BP fuel. But he said the new DLC injectors will alleviate the issue having the fully coated spindle.

The Prado runs so much quieter now. Early days but hopefully I can finally be happy with my Prado. I am happy with the service I received from baileys, things go wrong from time to time, failures happen. But it's how a company responds to these problems which builds a reputation.
If you read this Matt, thank you for your service.

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

That's what puzzled me about mine. Total vol is about 12 from cold and 6 when hot. All under 1 when hot too. We will see what they say when they've had a look.

They are really pretty good readings, you have to be carefull reading too much into cold readings.
Other things can affect feedback values & we don't all have new engines, especially if they have been fed dirty, hot, unfiltered egr for 100,000k+.
So you can't always get perfect cold readings, even with new Injectors.

This stuff is quite complicated & weird things happen too.
One set of baileys I installed in a customers Hilux in december 14 started cold the next day, one was -2.4, so I was concerned & said we will watch it.
Currently (6months ths later) from cold to hot they are all well under 1. So it fixed itself.

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

Well you can add me to that list. Had baileys installed at rebuild time (about 3 weeks before they released their full DLC sets, just missed out). Have done 30,000 km in that time, approx 14 months. Haven't been fully happy with the Prado since the engine rebuild but haven't been able to figure out what's not right.
Regular feedback checks showed injectors all good. Winter comes and the cold starts get progressively noisier, feedback check suddenly shows injectors 1,2 and 3 all around -1 but injector 4 reading +2.6! Technically still in tolerance but obvious sign of an underlying issue. So after discussing the findings with Matt bailey I pulled the injectors and sent them down for evaluation for a warranty claim. 2 injectors were found to be faulty (even though only one had bad feedback readings). All 4 replaced under warranty with a set of full DLCs. My personal opinion is that there's been something not right with the injectors since the day they were installed, but that's only my opinion and I have no proof other than a gut feeling, maybe it was just the bitter taste of engine failure that I couldn't get rid of which made me nervous and suspicious of every little thing.
Matts theory for the failures was fuel quality (not contamination, just poor fuel grade). He recommended using BP fuel. But he said the new DLC injectors will alleviate the issue having the fully coated spindle.

The Prado runs so much quieter now. Early days but hopefully I can finally be happy with my Prado. I am happy with the service I received from baileys, things go wrong from time to time, failures happen. But it's how a company responds to these problems which builds a reputation.
If you read this Matt, thank you for your service.

Some comments,

Lots of people seem to have issues with rebuilt engines, (hopefully yours is ok) that's why the Toyota long or short motor should be carefully considered. Start from scratch.
If anyone has the pre full coated gear, i would recommend you take up Matts offer of the half price upgrade
As usual with any Injectors (new or bdg) watch your values.
Many engines do get noisier this time of the year, can be horrid for the first minute or 2, even with good feedback values.
The full DLC gear is definitely quieter!
That's right sh!t happens, but in my experience the service from MATT & the team is very good.

[azzss Member Find all posts View Profile Close azzss]

Yes, i wished id gone with a toyota long engine, mine was rebuilt.....goes good and no rattles but uses oil now and it never used to before the rebuild.

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

Yes, i wished id gone with a toyota long engine, mine was rebuilt.....goes good and no rattles but uses oil now and it never used to before the rebuild.

Even with hundreds of thousands of Klm's, these engines dont use any oil.
I can't figure out why these rebuilders can't get it right.

[r4ndll Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close r4ndll]

They are really pretty good readings, you have to be carefull reading too much into cold readings.
Other things can affect feedback values & we don't all have new engines, especially if they have been fed dirty, hot, unfiltered egr for 100,000k+.
So you can't always get perfect cold readings, even with new Injectors.

This stuff is quite complicated & weird things happen too.
One set of baileys I installed in a customers Hilux in december 14 started cold the next day, one was -2.4, so I was concerned & said we will watch it.
Currently (6months ths later) from cold to hot they are all well under 1. So it fixed itself.

Yeah. This stuff is all black magic to me. That's why mine's going back to Baileys for a couple of days for them to look at and get their opinion. Ran the test this morning and it's at -2.5. I'm not bagging them out. I'd rather err on the side of caution as they're only 30mins down the road from me. They offered to look at it, no questions asked.

It's only because the recent cold weather has made it really noisy. I'm used to diesel's being noisy on cold mornings (we've owned a diesel car every year since I was about 5) but this seems exceptionally so.

[120D4D Avid PP Poster! Find all posts View Profile Close 120D4D]

Many engines do get noisier this time of the year, can be horrid for the first minute or 2, even with good feedback values.
The full DLC gear is definitely quieter!

Agreed, the cold makes everything a little horrid, my concern is those DLC spindles with good feedbacks that again start to rattle and this is a downward path to bad feedback numbers and injectors that run out of spec.

No doubt about it the full DLC's are quieter, but what about all those old soleniods floating around?, perhaps the soleniod is the next problem we'll start to face - the DLC bits are fine and maybe the old soleniods cant handle the cold?

[Anth120playdo Banned Find all posts View Profile Close Anth120playdo]

Agreed, the cold makes everything a little horrid, my concern is those DLC spindles with good feedbacks that again start to rattle and this is a downward path to bad feedback numbers and injectors that run out of spec.

No doubt about it the full DLC's are quieter, but what about all those old soleniods floating around?, perhaps the soleniod is the next problem we'll start to face - the DLC bits are fine and maybe the old soleniods cant handle the cold?

The solenoids seem to work well, luckily they don't seem to be part of the problem.
An electronic component that's more reliable than the old school mechanicals, unusual but true.