Replacing front springs on a Grande??

[tileys Member Find all posts View Profile Close tileys]

Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

Thanks Mick,

Why is it an important factor - this presumably is an indicator of the rebound limit you will get - any less than 60mm means the shock is under too much tension under extension ? (poetry...

[MickL Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close MickL]

Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

Why is it an important factor

In this case (Zappers king spring/standard shock combination) the shock is poorly matched to the spring and if its too close to the "Droop" limit the shock will be constantly bashed against its extended limit even over moderate terrain and basically be pounded to an early failure.

Mick

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Re:

if you replace the fronts and get a lift, does that mean you have to drive all the time with the rear set to high so it doesn't look like you're carrying 4 tone in the back causing the nose to be up in the air?

or not that pronounced?

I'm pretty interested in a bit of front lift too! Don't have a winch, but would love a bit of extra clearance - which i thought might not be possible on the front of the Grande.. but seems like it is.



Now i will need to find someone in Perth to do it.

What springs are recommended do you think? The Kings regular or Heavy Duty?

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Re: Re:

What springs are recommended do you think? The Kings regular or Heavy Duty?

Regular if you don't have a nose job, HD if you do.

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Re: Re:

What springs are recommended do you think? The Kings regular or Heavy Duty?

Regular if you don't have a nose job, HD if you do.

By Nose job you mean front bar right? :P

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Re:

Is this with your rear height set at Neutral?
I am just worried that the front will be higher than the rear in a normal driving position...

before lift







After lift





Darren I have checked the droop and its about 65mm and rechecked the measurements while I was at it and the front is at 777mm and the back is now 781mm after the wheel alignment and a full tank of gas.
I will now let it settle and see what I end up with but at this stage its what I was after in retaining current factory controls and boosting the front end. The extra money save at this point are going for a new set of tyres that is now need urgent attention .

Zapper

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Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

Oh yeah something else i wanted to ask, how dark is your window tinting?

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Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

Wouldn't the reduction in droop cause less articulation => loss of traction => install front diff locker?

[MickL Addicted PP Member Find all posts View Profile Close MickL]

Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

Wouldn't the reduction in droop cause less articulation => loss of traction => install front diff locker?

If you look at it in the most basic way then yes, the loss in articulation can be counteracted with a locker. However there are a few other things to consider.

A locker isn't the be all and end all... even with a locker it's better to have two wheels on the ground than one. Both for traction and steering control (of which you have less of with a front locker engaged)

You need to maintain some droop, as I mentioned before for the sake of shock life, and also ride quality. Downward travel is as important as upward travel in suspension. You want to absorb the holes in the road as well as the bumps.

If you have little or no downward travel then the front end is going to fall into every hole you drive over instead of the tyre rolling down into it and the suspension absorbing the movement. The problem with the front falling into large enough holes is the weight transfer is huge and the vehicle will hit the bump stops often and hard, your ride will be crap, your control of the vehicle will be compromised and something will break in the end.

The whole point of suspension is the vehicle stays as level as possible whilst the tyres all stay in contact with the ground as much as possible whilst limiting the amount of bumps and dips transferred into the vehicle.

Mick

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Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

less than 60mm of droop [70mm is most preferable] and you start lifting wheels turning at the traffic lights, or the round about, and the shock being topped out regularly, and it will end up damaging the shock.

The "perfect "set up for offroad is normally 1/3 of suspension travel in up travel, and 2/3 down travel, in the ideal set up, but the prado front end doesnt offer that type of travel without some new parts.

[speed_racer Member Find all posts View Profile Close speed_racer]

Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

less than 60mm of droop [70mm is most preferable] and you start lifting wheels turning at the traffic lights, or the round about, and the shock being topped out regularly, and it will end up damaging the shock.

The "perfect "set up for offroad is normally 1/3 of suspension travel in up travel, and 2/3 down travel, in the ideal set up, but the prado front end doesnt offer that type of travel without some new parts.

SO ... you think not a good idea unless you go and replace front shocks as well? I am looking at doing this from a ground clearance point of view, but cerrtainly understand what you are saying here.

Not many people have done this with their grandes... but i am seriosuly contemplating for the same reasons zapper did. I guess if the front shocks do give out i can always replace them ?

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Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

less than 60mm of droop [70mm is most preferable] and you start lifting wheels turning at the traffic lights, or the round about, and the shock being topped out regularly, and it will end up damaging the shock.

The "perfect "set up for offroad is normally 1/3 of suspension travel in up travel, and 2/3 down travel, in the ideal set up, but the prado front end doesnt offer that type of travel without some new parts.

SO ... you think not a good idea unless you go and replace front shocks as well? I am looking at doing this from a ground clearance point of view, but cerrtainly understand what you are saying here.

Not many people have done this with their grandes... but i am seriosuly contemplating for the same reasons zapper did. I guess if the front shocks do give out i can always replace them ?

Depends on where you are, wether it pulls apart completely, or just spews all the oil out, as to wether, and how much it will cost, to replace it.

Its simple engineering, you want trouble,a nd the car to lift wheels all the time, set it where ever you think, and dont worry about the droop, you want iot to do what it should, and not destroy shocks, then keep 70mm of droop.

We do many many Grandes with lift, its very common, but we stick to the proven rules that have been discovered by trial, and $error$...

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Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

I thought I'd better check on my current droop before doing anything rash.

750mm current front height
845mm when jacked up

So only 95mm droop.

I think I'll leave the suspension upgrade alone for a while as I'd want to do it properly with both spring and shock upgraded.

[speed_racer Member Find all posts View Profile Close speed_racer]

Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

less than 60mm of droop [70mm is most preferable] and you start lifting wheels turning at the traffic lights, or the round about, and the shock being topped out regularly, and it will end up damaging the shock.

The "perfect "set up for offroad is normally 1/3 of suspension travel in up travel, and 2/3 down travel, in the ideal set up, but the prado front end doesnt offer that type of travel without some new parts.

SO ... you think not a good idea unless you go and replace front shocks as well? I am looking at doing this from a ground clearance point of view, but cerrtainly understand what you are saying here.

Not many people have done this with their grandes... but i am seriosuly contemplating for the same reasons zapper did. I guess if the front shocks do give out i can always replace them ?

Depends on where you are, wether it pulls apart completely, or just spews all the oil out, as to wether, and how much it will cost, to replace it.

Its simple engineering, you want trouble,a nd the car to lift wheels all the time, set it where ever you think, and dont worry about the droop, you want iot to do what it should, and not destroy shocks, then keep 70mm of droop.

We do many many Grandes with lift, its very common, but we stick to the proven rules that have been discovered by trial, and $error$...

So in your opinion, either go and get rid of the TEMS and replace with something like Bilsteins.. but dont just replace front springs?
:S

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Re: Replacing front springs on a Grande??

So in your opinion, either go and get rid of the TEMS and replace with something like Bilsteins.. but dont just replace front springs?
:S

I think you will find you are the only one who has said that so far in this thread.

just stick to a minimum of 60mm [70mm pereffered] of droop, and you shouldnt have any trouble, is what I am saying.