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  • Front end Clunk

    Having replaced my shocks and springs all round and UCAs in front was disappointed to hear a clunk when doing some play tracks when the front flexed and sometimes just cornering/ driveways in the wet.
    I'm thinking it might be the lower ball joints, can anybody tell me where to get the best ball joints and while I'm at it might as well do tie rod ends too. I know my 4runner I just ordered off ebay, but being that this car is a keeper would prefer to get the toughest I can!

    Thanks

  • #2
    Hi. For the 90 Series the genuine lower ball joints are by far the best but pretty bloody pricey at approx $350.00 each.
    You could go a Transteering or Road Safe Ball Joint for approx $150-$170 each.

    Get someone to check it out for you first before you spend a lot of money on bits for it.

    Regards, Jason.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by Franko78 View Post
      Having replaced my shocks and springs all round and UCAs in front was disappointed to hear a clunk when doing some play tracks when the front flexed and sometimes just cornering/ driveways in the wet.
      I'm thinking it might be the lower ball joints, can anybody tell me where to get the best ball joints and while I'm at it might as well do tie rod ends too. I know my 4runner I just ordered off ebay, but being that this car is a keeper would prefer to get the toughest I can!

      Thanks
      It could also be the lower bushings. I recommend not replacing anything (especially ball joints) until you've confirmed the cause - otherwise you may be replacing quality Japanese parts with inferior aftermarket parts (or wasting money on Toyota parts). Some of these Toyota parts go forever.

      Lower ball joint is easy to check. Raise the front end, try to shake wheels/tyres vertically. There should be no vertical play - and if there is it'll be easy to tell.

      You can also shake horizontally at the same time to check the steering. There will always be a little play in the rack - the idea here it to determine if the tie rod ends have play or not (which is unlikely - because the racks usually go first) or if the rack is sliding around due to stuffed bushings. Racks last around 200,000km

      LCA bushings are a little harder. Vehicle raised, use a bar of some kind to attempt to move the lower control arms - perhaps you'll find one moves more than the others. The way I usually check them is on the ground - get underneath and watch the bushings whilst a strong assistant shakes the crap out of the entire vehicle front end from the bull bar. You'll need the entire front end to be swaying left/right to put enough pressure on the LCA bushings.

      Other possibilities are completely failed sway bar bushings (easily visible), a CV axle (needs to be tested in motion with steering turned), or the new suspension has come loose and need tightening.
      glen_ep - engineered, 4" lift, 33" 255/85R16, lockers, 4.88 ratios www.pradopoint.com.au/showthread.php?17237 www.youtube.com/user/glenep www.fb.com/groups/ToyotaPrado90

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      • #4
        Hmm.. I was under the car on the hoist and the guy was prodding with a crowbar, sort of flexing in between the LCAs and thr cross member and although I could see some movement and some rubber deterioration it didn't look excessive and even he said being original fitment eventually it would need doing but it would easily see out anothrr year.
        Would it be noticeable with a wheel alignment if the ball joint was gone? Are the CV's the same as front wheel drive xars when you go in reverse full lock they will make noise? I re torqued all bolts a day before I first went offroad but will check them again. D rubbers are worn on sway bar but for such a noticeable localized noise in the front right it would have to be link pin. Again, rubbers a bit perished but this noise is definitely a clunk and even happened in the rain going over a large speed bump on an angle at low speed. Atleast offroad it was flexing for it to happen.. Will jack it up and if I can't confirm anything will book it in for diagnosis.
        That's an expensive ball joint at $350 each!! Looks like I won't be doing fault finding by part substitution

        Comment


        • #5
          In an ideal world a ball joint failure should be found during an alignment, but this world is far from it. If they didn't specifically check then I would NOT count on them finding it. Lift the front and shake the tyres, it's easy!

          Yes, you can check CV's like on FWD cars for clicking but none of my failed CV's had that sound. I found mine by lifting the entire vehicle and driving/turning/listening. It's a dangerous test though.

          Does it occur whilst braking, coasting or accelerating? Straight vs corners? Flex vs no flex? Is it a squeak, thud or clang?
          glen_ep - engineered, 4" lift, 33" 255/85R16, lockers, 4.88 ratios www.pradopoint.com.au/showthread.php?17237 www.youtube.com/user/glenep www.fb.com/groups/ToyotaPrado90

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          • #6
            My front C'V's were totally shot, and never made a sound either. If the vehicle is lifted they tend to get chewed out faster than a standard height vehicle.
            Had them rebuilt to premium quality for $220 each I think, replace the oil seals in the trans axel if you change the front drive shafts, they are different sizes, about 12 bucks from Toyota.

            The steering mount rubbers cause noise, but usually can also feel it in the steering wheel as well. Worn rack ends and tie rods don't usually make noise, just play in the steering, and poor wheel alignments.

            Could be worn wishbone rubbers or sway bar rubbers as Glen has said.
            My left front link rod was busted and I never knew until I was doing my suspension replacement.

            Going back over the new suspension and recheck everything can't hurt, but you have done it once.

            If you are not confident in diagnosing it a competent suspension shop should be able to do it for you.
            Just watch out they are not trying to manufacture work for themselves by telling you things are stuffed when they are not.

            Keep us posted.
            Cheers
            Ken

            Comment


            • #7
              I've been slack and haven't looked into it yet, though I know I can hit speed bumps front on of varying sizes without it making noise but any sort of left then right giving flex makes it clunk. I remember my old troopie used to make a similar noise in the wet when the leaf suspension used to settle? Steering rack bushes look near new, sway bar D rubbers pretty shot but definitely only RH front.
              Maybe a coincidence or maybe not but the RH front also has a balance issue from 60 - 80km/h. Will book it in for that and hopefully the rest will be known

              Comment


              • #8
                There's a few possibilities for bad balance - faulty tyre, faulty/damaged rim, out of alignment, failed bearings, or ball joints on that side.

                In that scenario I'd primarily suspect:

                * Lower control arm bushings. They definitely make a sound on road when worn, even slightly worn, but they're hard to confirm because are under heavy strain at all times. A little movement here can mean a lot. Due to difficulty to test, mechanics could miss this. If these need to be changed, be aware that an alignment will be required afterwards, and pressing new bushes into the old arms can damage the arms. It happened on mine - 3 were changed fine, but 1 caused the LCA section to be stretched/worn too much requiring the entire arm to be replaced.

                * Ball Joints (upper or lower). I once had a failed upper which didn't make a sound at all, but it was very easy to test and confirm (the tyre could be tilted in/out by hand causing a sound). My opinion, from my experience, it's so easy to see, don't change them unless you can be shown it's not right.

                - Sway/stability bar. Not the D bushes, but the bushings on the links. My front bar once broke free of the link bushings and started to slide up/down the link. This makes a sound when changing directions but you'd also feel the handling difference - oh, you haven't mentioned bad handling, so that's probably not it.
                glen_ep - engineered, 4" lift, 33" 255/85R16, lockers, 4.88 ratios www.pradopoint.com.au/showthread.php?17237 www.youtube.com/user/glenep www.fb.com/groups/ToyotaPrado90

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                • #9
                  My vote goes to lower control arm bushes too.
                  95 3.0 Camp Car, 150 V6 Daily Driver[SIZE=4]
                  [/SIZE]

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                  • #10
                    Yep, fun to do as well. the Adjustment bolt and adjustment cam assembly can be a bugger to get out too, my LH one was badly damaged from someone's else's efforts with a drift in the past, bought and fitted a new one. Use plenty of anti-seize on these

                    If your suspension was not new I would ask if it is the bump stops hitting, mine did with a fairly loud "Clunk" before I fitted all the new goodies.

                    Keep us posted mate.

                    Cheers
                    Ken

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Small update..

                      I went to WA Suspensions and had the car test driven and thank my lucky stars it made noises driven on an angle over a speed bump though straight over at speed had no noise.
                      The crowbar under the front right gave the lower ball joint about 2-3mm of travel but nothing stood out as being the source of the very obvious clunk. They suggested as a process of elimination disconnecting the sway bar link on the front right which I attempted to do in a carpark but couldn't budge the bar to drop the link out. Loosened the nut right off and although driving over islands and speed bumps didn't make any noise a little sand track still made the sound but not as bad as usual.

                      I'm thinking swaybar links.. looking into choices of whiteline vs wholesale suspension links and d rubbers..

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                      • #12
                        Nice one

                        Glad you found something.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          2-3mm of movement in one of the LBJ's in a 95 is way over spec, which is:
                          (a) Remove the tire and install the hub nuts to the disc.
                          (b) Using a dial indicator, check the lower ball joint for excessive play when you push the hub nuts up and down with a force of 294 N (30 kgf, 66 lbf).
                          Maximum: 0.5 mm (0.020 in.)

                          So there's your clunk. Probably.

                          Comment

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