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Piggy
30-01-2007, 11:27 PM
*Split from the Fatboy globe thread as it is under HID testing really*

Fitted out one side of the prado with HID plasma Xenons tonight as a trial.

Definiently more light, but also discovered a few things that need addressing.
1:
The prado appears to run Lo beam and when you flick to HI-Beam it runs Both HI & Lo beams at once giving a greater fill on the short range.
With HID you lose the Lo beams when you change to HI and as a result a slight amount of close in fill. (Not a real big issue)

2:
The HID kits they are selling around the place and classed as "Bi-Xenon" are in fact classed as a H4-3 (Mechanical Xenon HI/LO), they use a solenoid to pull the globe back/forward to adjust for hi-lo beam positions in the reflector.
A True Bi-Xenon uses 2 Xenon HID tubes a Hi and a Lo, these are not easy to find is Aust. I am looking for some sets in China now as these would be the ultimate light for the standard headlights!

3:
The Prado appears to use a funny switching mechanism, which requires a bit of fiddling around to get the HID setup (wiring loom) to switch and work properly.

4:
More a plus, the Headlight itself runs heaps cooler with the HID in it, about 20 degrees from the testing we did (exterior of glass/plastic).

5:
The solenoids that do the Hi/Lo switch are quite *thunky* when they engage. (Not a big issue). True Bi-Xenons wont have this issue.

Will post pics tomorrow when I get a chance, the light is certainly a lot better than the fatboys, but there is still a bit of an annoying cutoff on the drivers side.

Grandeman
31-01-2007, 02:31 AM
Thanks Piggy - looks like you know your HID stuff intimately.

Stops us getting ripped off by the increasing number of the Xenon fly-by-nite sellers out there...

Look forward to hearing more (and seeing the pics) as you go!

Piggy
31-01-2007, 12:10 PM
I will start a new thread on the HID in a bit in anticipation of the maybe upcoming technical section :D

Per Slads question HID BI Xenon has a smaller back on it and will fit in easier than the original bulbs! (Less protrusion).

Mechanical Xenon protrudes a bit, all of these details I am giving currently relate to mechanical Xenons until Iget the True Bi-Xenons from China.

HID (H4-3) Mechanical Xenon shown here. (This uses a solenoid to push/pull the globe into Hi/Lo position).
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/H43mechanicalhilo.jpg

Fitted to Drivers side light.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/HIDfittedbehind.jpg

And I know your all gonna ask so heres the difference to a Fatboy.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/FatboyvsHIDLObeam.jpg
Now one of the issues I have noticed is some bleed through of the Hi Beam Slot * See note on pic 1* on lo beam, you can see this on the HID (Right side) above the normal low beam. (Looks like a yellow-white oblong rectangle).
I was worried about this blinding other drivers, but have tested extensively doing walk & drive by's on the piggy test road :roll: and it is not an issue unless your directly in front and within 15-20 feet...
As you can see it goes up at a pretty sharp angle and is higher than other drivers within 10 feet of the car.

Piggy
31-01-2007, 12:23 PM
Lighting onto road. (Lo Beam)

Conditions, Clear night, Street light 4 mtrs to RHS of front corner of car. Good street lighting on road.

IPF Fatboy Lo Beam (Left light only) Roughly 3500 K
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/fatboyLO.jpg

HID Lo Beam (Right light only) 6000K
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/HIDLO.jpg

Fatboy & HID Lo Beam.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/FatboyHIDFront.jpg

McBAIN
31-01-2007, 01:29 PM
crikey that's a significant difference!

Piggy
31-01-2007, 02:29 PM
Fatboy vs HID lo/hi.

Fatboy Lo-beam.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/LobeamFatboys.jpg

Fatboy Hi-beam.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/HIbeamFatboys.jpg

Fatboy/HID Lo-beam.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/FatboyvsHIDLObeam.jpg

Fatboy/HID Hi-beam.
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/FatboyvsHIDHiBeam.jpg

Notice as per my note on previous post.
With HID Lo Beam is moved to become Hi Beam, hence not as much in close coverage, evident in last pic.
The lines on the roller door allow you to easily see the different spreads.

I am pretty adamant that fitting of HID will also need a good manual headlight readjustment to get good road coverage. (My Drivers side is a bit too far to the right currently trying to fill that damn black spot!)

McBAIN
06-02-2007, 01:16 AM
Hey TP, mind if i ask where from and how many $$$'s for the set?

Piggy
06-02-2007, 06:32 PM
Some factory in China ;) and about $200.(AUD)

I am (maybe) looking at bringing in a bunch of HID stuff in the near future. Am just testing a bunch of kits out currently.

Grandeman
06-02-2007, 06:45 PM
Wow, Piggy - that's pretty sharp pricing for real bi-xenon.

Way to go! - hope the testing works out fine.

Piggy
06-02-2007, 11:20 PM
Wow, Piggy - that's pretty sharp pricing for real bi-xenon.


Should have noted, that is H4-3 (Mechanical Bi-Xenon) as shown in the pics.

Real Bi-Xenon (H4-4) (Two x HID globes in one housing) will be a bit dearer, Still to test them as of yet.

HID's take about 10 seconds to come to full brightness, they are OK at startup but need time to become super bright, not sure how this will work on the HI/LO bi-xenon (H4-4, twin tubes).

McBAIN
06-02-2007, 11:44 PM
Wow, Piggy - that's pretty sharp pricing for real bi-xenon.


Should have noted, that is H4-3 (Mechanical Bi-Xenon) as shown in the pics.

Real Bi-Xenon (H4-4) (Two x HID globes in one housing) will be a bit dearer, Still to test them as of yet.

HID's take about 10 seconds to come to full brightness, they are OK at startup but need time to become super bright, not sure how this will work on the HI/LO bi-xenon (H4-4, twin tubes).

Look forward to seeing how they go!

lc120_man
12-04-2007, 06:53 PM
Piggy,

Any idea if those will fit into Prado?

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Xenon-Light-Hid- ... dZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Xenon-Light-Hid-Conversion-kit-H1-H3-H4-H7-H9-9005-9006_W0QQitemZ190098101558QQcategoryZ102560QQrdZ1Q QcmdZViewItem)

Piggy
12-04-2007, 07:49 PM
They would in H4 but will be low beam only. You need H4-3 or H4-4 globes to get Hi/Lo beams.

H4-3 = Slider style Hi/Lo

H4-4 = True dual HID hi/Lo (4 ballast needed)

lc120_man
12-04-2007, 08:00 PM
They would in H4 but will be low beam only. You need H4-3 or H4-4 globes to get Hi/Lo beams.

H4-3 = Slider style Hi/Lo

H4-4 = True dual HID hi/Lo (4 ballast needed)


Thanks,

They got H4-3 ones as well
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Xenon-Light-HID- ... dZViewItem (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Xenon-Light-HID-CONVERSION-KIT-H4-H-L-BI-XENON_W0QQitemZ190101105590QQihZ009QQcategoryZ1025 60QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)

Might give them a go...

Piggy
12-04-2007, 10:57 PM
Be careful of the size of the slider on the H4-3 as you are very limited by the distance between the headlight casing and the battery! Some wont fit.

Testing is on another vehicle currently: STI RA WRX with 4 H1 HID's in Rallye 4000 compacts and a set of H4-2 HID in the normal headlights.
Night rally coming up in a month so should be interesting, at least it'll blind some spectators!

I havent been able to find any decent prices on true H4-4 (Bi-Xenon) and havent had time to investigate further.
Plus the fitting of 4 Ballasts is going to get very tight on any vehicle! (Getting 6 into a wrx has been interesting to say the least).

thmia
27-07-2007, 10:25 AM
They would in H4 but will be low beam only. You need H4-3 or H4-4 globes to get Hi/Lo beams.

H4-3 = Slider style Hi/Lo

H4-4 = True dual HID hi/Lo (4 ballast needed)
i bought my kit off ebay and this is the globe it shown to sell.
http://www.tomatowebdesign.com/Auctions ... HID_BI.jpg (http://www.tomatowebdesign.com/Auctions/PICS/HID/HID_BI.jpg)
but what i received is actually the image you posted
http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/D ... alhilo.jpg (http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i89/Detex-2006/HID%20lighting/H43mechanicalhilo.jpg)

before i complain. i just want to make sure i received incorrect item.
so these two globes are definitely different right? or they are just same globe but different look?

also if the seller is shipping me the correct globe. i just need to change the globes or i actually have to replace the whole kit? or the globes (H4-3 H4-4) can operate on the same kit?

Piggy
27-07-2007, 12:43 PM
This is a H4-3 globe, proper one for the kit you bought.
The others show a plastic rear (yuck) the alloy you got is better.

H4-4 (true Bi-Xenon) needs 4 x Ballast units to run them. no one sells them on Ebay.

thmia
27-07-2007, 01:19 PM
i am getting so confused now ...
sorry to trouble you so much but this is my first set of HID as a result i don't really know much about it.

so which is better H4-3? or H4-4?

but the advertisement i saw on ebay, which i end up buying is use magnetic field to change between HI/LO beam but the one i received is actually slider style ....

so the difference between my globe and the advertisement one is the end cover are different? is this what you are saying?

Piggy
27-07-2007, 02:14 PM
H4-4 is better, but again You will not find them on Ebay. You will most likely not find them on sale anywhere in Australia.

We got ours from China.

Squeaky
27-07-2007, 04:30 PM
i am getting so confused now ...
sorry to trouble you so much but this is my first set of HID as a result i don't really know much about it.

so which is better H4-3? or H4-4?

but the advertisement i saw on ebay, which i end up buying is use magnetic field to change between HI/LO beam but the one i received is actually slider style ....

so the difference between my globe and the advertisement one is the end cover are different? is this what you are saying?

The so called "magnetic field" is just a solenoid that moves the slider.
I would prefer the ones you received - in alloy. Your links are the same just different makes/quality.

thmia
27-07-2007, 04:31 PM
do you mind if i ask how do you get it from china ...
chinese ebay?
or you actually know someone who is manufacturing it?

what's the price if you also don't mind i ask ....
because the globes even if it is correct one that the seller shipped, it still a bit weird as both globes light tilted to top left ...

i heard someone saying it tilted to top left so the light doesn't go direct into the driver at the opposite direction but i really think the tilted is too obvious and too much personally.

i am still need to adjust the headlight base so it doesn't tilted that much ...

thmia
27-07-2007, 04:39 PM
The so called "magnetic field" is just a solenoid that moves the slider.
I would prefer the ones you received - in alloy. Your links are the same just different makes/quality.

:D :D now i am sure the sender shipped the correct item to me.

http://www.pradopoint.com/viewtopic.php?t=998
from the above link Richo said he can separate the globe part and the carrier so he doesn't need to modify the rubber seal ...
for the alloy version i have, i still haven't figure out a way to put the seal back without modify it :( :(

any experience about this?

dirttracker
24-10-2009, 06:19 PM
Hi,
I thought that it was worth dredging up this old thread to see if anyone has fitted an H4-4 HID headlights, that is, true dual bulb 4x ballast HID headlights. I see that they are available now from China, US and Hongkong. They have dual bulbs. One bulb is in the middle of the fitting and the second, longer is off to one side. I wonder what the effect of this is to the light pattern.